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Bob has two attack stats: he spawns by charging until he hits something and then remains stationary for a maximum of 10 seconds to fire at enemies, before finally despawning. Though he can contest a point and do other things like a player, he cannot open auto-doors like on Horizon Lunar Colony.

trying to choose between these 2 builds

but the big question i'm having is..does toughness work?
https://i.imgur.com/Tik2NSg.jpg

i got a ton of toughness here..and yet i take a 9.5k dmg hit with 3.5k toughness
which makes me question if toughness works..or is worth having at all. do crits ignore or reduce armor? does it only reduce dmg by so much?

and how did this do so much dmg..its an insane ammount..

Comments

• edited January 10, 2018

  Toughness did work on the direct damage
  (Direct damage = Damage inflicted by skills and/or traits directly, can crit, and is mitigated by the target's armor.)

  Basically this is the calculation:
  Damage you received = Enemy's Weapon strength * Enemy's Power * Enemy's skill-specific coefficient / Your Armor

  • AFAIK, critical hit increase direct damage, but it is not ignoring armor
  • Did you have vulnerability on you? Vulnerability increases condition damage and direct damage you received

  More on here:
  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Toughness
  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Damage#Direct_damage

  What kind of class / what skill do you get attacked with by the way? (Skill have a unique coefficient used to calculate damage inflicted)

• edited January 10, 2018

  @akenoyuki.8210 said:
  Toughness did work on the direct damage
  (Direct damage = Damage inflicted by skills and/or traits directly, can crit, and is mitigated by the target's armor.)

  Basically this is the calculation:
  Damage you received = Enemy's Weapon strength * Enemy's Power * Enemy's skill-specific coefficient / Your Armor

  Did you have vulnerability on you? Vulnerability increases condition damage and direct damage you received

  More on here:
  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Toughness
  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Damage#Direct_damage

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  What kind of class / what skill do you get attacked with by the way? (Skill have a unique coefficient used to calculate damage inflicted)

  no vulnerability, had just used the Natural healing skill.

  got hit by this
  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wastrel's_Ruin

  which has a coefficient of 1.5
  plus 100% more dmg.

  but no matter how much i use the armor formula. i can't understand just how he got enough attack power/strength to hit a 3.5k armor warrior for 9.5k dmg

  assuming they have 2700 power. 1030 dagger. the 1.5x2 coeficient. that would only do 3k
  and then a crit for say 225%..and its still only 6750

• edited January 10, 2018

  Hmm.. Maybe there's more to it
  I see you're on WvW mode, did you perhaps got attacked near enemy castle / keep?
  I rarely go to WvW so I'm not really sure, but there are some boon you get if you're near the castle / keep such as the guild objective aura and presence of the keep right?

  Also since it is WvW, did your enemy have 25 might, bloodlust, or something like that too?
  I'm afraid there's a lot of unknown variable on this.

• @arenta.2953 said:
  trying to choose between these 2 builds

  but the big question i'm having is..does toughness work?
  https://i.imgur.com/Tik2NSg.jpg

  i got a ton of toughness here..and yet i take a 9.5k dmg hit with 3.5k toughness
  which makes me question if toughness works..or is worth having at all. do crits ignore or reduce armor? does it only reduce dmg by so much?

  and how did this do so much dmg..its an insane ammount..

  Warriors have a few traits that conditionally buff toughness:
  • Thick Skin - +180 toughness when above 75% hp
  • Spiked Armor - +150 toughness when you have retaliation. Gain 5s of retaliation when you block or are hit by a crit. --> You likely didn't have retaliation as a buff as your combat log shows you getting hit by necros shades, well of corruption and loss aversion.
  • Your screen shot is at a keep and you have the Presence of the Keep buff on you which is giving you +100 toughness (also +100 to power, precision, vitality stats).
  --> Based on the above, subtract 280 toughness from the value shown in the display window in the screen shot

  You don't know how buffed the warrior was (i.e. might stacks on him, bloodlust sigil stacks, stacks of Insight, vulnerability on you).

  Investing in toughness suffers diminishing returns: for each additional point of toughness you add to your build you get incrementally less and less reduction in damage. Direct damage continues to scale in a linear manner. The system was setup like this likely as a way to prevent a situation where a player could create an unkillable tank in pvp. (Sidenote: HoT especially took a massive dump on this system by adding flat percentage damage reduction modifiers and food to the game). Wastrel's Ruin has a +100% damage modifier if it hit you and you aren't using a skill at the time. If you were using a skill at the time he hit you, he would have crit you for 4,737 damage instead of 9,475.

  TLDR:
  • Stacking toughness is not the best way to go
  • The 9,475 damage hit you took is legit

• @akenoyuki.8210 said:
  Hmm.. Maybe there's more to it
  I see you're on WvW mode, did you perhaps got attacked near enemy castle / keep?
  I rarely go to WvW so I'm not really sure, but there are some boon you get if you're near the castle / keep such as the guild objective aura and presence of the keep right?

  you are correct, the buff gives +100 to all stats.

  but even that isn't enough to explain it

  plus, this was by a tier 1 supply camp.

• @Naix.8156 said:

  @arenta.2953 said:
  trying to choose between these 2 builds

  but the big question i'm having is..does toughness work?
  https://i.imgur.com/Tik2NSg.jpg

  i got a ton of toughness here..and yet i take a 9.5k dmg hit with 3.5k toughness
  which makes me question if toughness works..or is worth having at all. do crits ignore or reduce armor? does it only reduce dmg by so much?

  and how did this do so much dmg..its an insane ammount..

  Warriors have a few traits that conditionally buff toughness:
  • Thick Skin - +180 toughness when above 75% hp
  • Spiked Armor - +150 toughness when you have retaliation. Gain 5s of retaliation when you block or are hit by a crit. --> You likely didn't have retaliation as a buff as your combat log shows you getting hit by necros shades, well of corruption and loss aversion.
  • Your screen shot is at a keep and you have the Presence of the Keep buff on you which is giving you +100 toughness (also +100 to power, precision, vitality stats).
  --> Based on the above, subtract 280 toughness from the value shown in the display window in the screen shot

  You don't know how buffed the warrior was (i.e. might stacks on him, bloodlust sigil stacks, stacks of Insight, vulnerability on you).

  Investing in toughness suffers diminishing returns: for each additional point of toughness you add to your build you get incrementally less and less reduction in damage. Direct damage continues to scale in a linear manner. The system was setup like this likely as a way to prevent a situation where a player could create an unkillable tank in pvp. (Sidenote: HoT especially took a massive dump on this system by adding flat percentage damage reduction modifiers and food to the game). Wastrel's Ruin has a +100% damage modifier if it hit you and you aren't using a skill at the time. If you were using a skill at the time he hit you, he would have crit you for 4,737 damage instead of 9,475.

  TLDR:
  • Stacking toughness is not the best way to go
  • The 9,475 damage hit you took is legit

  ah.diminishing returns
  is there a recommended armor level its suggested to stop at

• @arenta.2953 said:
  but no matter how much i use the armor formula. i can't understand just how he got enough attack power/strength to hit a 3.5k armor warrior for 9.5k dmg

  assuming they have 2700 power. 1030 dagger. the 1.5x2 coeficient. that would only do 3k
  and then a crit for say 225%..and its still only 6750

  You haven't taken into account damage bonus and reduction modifiers.

  If the guy was in zerk gear, scholars runes, food, etc the power value would be around 4100 at the top end; so likely you've underestimated the power value.

• @arenta.2953 said:
  ah.diminishing returns
  is there a recommended armor level its suggested to stop at

  There isn't a set number to stop at, no. In general its best, in all areas of the game not just in wvw, to use other means to mitigate or avoid damage instead of just stats. Some examples: blocks, evades, invulnerability, immunities, protection boon (-33% inc dmg), using kiting/line-of-siting, etc. Guild Wars 2 has an active combat system so its (generally speaking - not to get into power creep and passives from the expansions) best to use active abilities to avoid the damage in the first place.

  If you join a wvw guild focused guild they would be able to help you with your build and explain stuff in comms (discord, ts, etc) to help you out.

• @arenta.2953 said:

  @akenoyuki.8210 said:
  Toughness did work on the direct damage
  (Direct damage = Damage inflicted by skills and/or traits directly, can crit, and is mitigated by the target's armor.)

  Basically this is the calculation:
  Damage you received = Enemy's Weapon strength * Enemy's Power * Enemy's skill-specific coefficient / Your Armor

  Did you have vulnerability on you? Vulnerability increases condition damage and direct damage you received

  More on here:
  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Toughness
  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Damage#Direct_damage

  What kind of class / what skill do you get attacked with by the way? (Skill have a unique coefficient used to calculate damage inflicted)

  no vulnerability, had just used the Natural healing skill.

  got hit by this
  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wastrel's_Ruin

  which has a coefficient of 1.5
  plus 100% more dmg.

  but no matter how much i use the armor formula. i can't understand just how he got enough attack power/strength to hit a 3.5k armor warrior for 9.5k dmg

  assuming they have 2700 power. 1030 dagger. the 1.5x2 coeficient. that would only do 3k
  and then a crit for say 225%..and its still only 6750

  That isn't even the top end damage

  970(lowest roll for weapon strength) * 1.5(coeff) * 3500(roughly 2500 base from berserker stat + 1000 for 25 stacks of might) / 3500 * 2.32(critical damage base + berserker stat+ Pure Strike ) * 2(100% more damage) 1.05(sigil of force)1.33(peak performance) = 9428

Basic Attacks (also called AA - Auto Attack) are the attacks that a Hero, Minion, Mercenary, Monster, Summon or Structure will perform automatically, if they are capable of hitting the target. Players can cause the units they are controlling to perform a Basic Attack by pressing the Right Mouse Button on an enemy unit. Most units' Basic Attacks deal Physical Damage almost exclusively, except in some circumstances. As an exception, Non-heroicSummons' Basic Attacks deal Spell damage. Floating damage text displays the damage dealt by physical attacks as orange numbers above the target's head. Damage from Physical Basic Attacks can be reduced by applying Armor, Physical Armor or Parry on the target or any physical and all-damage attack debuffs on the attacker. Blind is a debuff that causes the affected units miss their Basic Attacks for a set period of time, and Heroes with Evasion cannot be hit by Basic Attacks.

Some Heroes are designed around their ability to do damage through Basic Attacks so have higher Base damage or Attack Speed. Heroes like Raynor or Sgt Hammer utilize their Basic Attacks for the majority of their damage, and Heroes like Illidan or The Butcher require their Basic Attacks hitting to survive due to their heavy reliance on attack Lifesteal. Other Heroes (typically mages or supports) do very little auto attack damage because their kit may provide utility elsewhere, or their damage might simply be based on their Abilities instead.

• 1Basic properties

Basic properties[editedit source]

Attack Damage[editedit source]

The Base damage statistic determines the damage a unit does when they attack an enemy with their Basic Attack. All heroes start with a Base attack damage value that increases with Scaling, and certain abilities or talents (such as Follow Through) can also increase attack damage under certain circumstances. A couple heroes such as Li-Ming, Kel'thuzad, and Kael'thas can make their Basic Attacks deal Spell damage instead through certain talent selections.

Attack Speed[editedit source]

Main article: Attack Speed

Attack Speed (not to be confused with the speed of the attack projectile) is the rate at which a unit can use their Basic Attack. Attack Speed is measured in attacks per second, so higher Attack Speed values mean more attacks per second and lower Attack Speed values mean the opposite. The combination of Attack Speed and Attack damage multiply together to show a Hero's damage per second (dps), and many Basic Attack focused Heroes utilize having a high dps to kill their enemies. Some Talents and Abilities can increase Attack Speed, while other talents like Imposing Presence can greatly reduce it.

Attack Range[editedit source]

Main article: Range

Each unit has a certain range that targets must be within to be able to attack them, measured from the edge of the attacking unit's hitbox to the edge of the target's hitbox. If a Hero wishes to attack someone outside of their range they will first have to move closer to be able to target them. The attack range of a hero also determines whether they are melee or ranged, with ranged Heroes having longer range but generally utilizing projectiles, and melee Heroes having short range but their hits landing instantly.

Stutter-stepping[editedit source]

Stutter-stepping is a vital technique for Basic Attack driven Heroes that involves rapidly moving between each Basic Attack's 'cooldown' to maximize mobility without losing overall damage per second. Stutter-stepping can be used to cover distance while chasing the target to prevent target getting out of your Range, or to make your Hero a moving target to make it harder to aim skillshots at it. The effectiveness of stutter-stepping is very reliant of the Hero's Attack Speed. Heroes with high Attack Speed, like Zarya and Tychus, have only a little time between attacks to move, causing them to lose dps by trying to stutter-step, so they are usually required to stop attacking completely and reposition. However, this is a non-issue for Heroes who can attack while moving, like Tracer, Lucio or D.Va, or Heroes with slow Attack Speed, like Leoric, that can cover more ground between the attacks and are less likely to lose dps because of it.

Trivia[editedit source]

Blizzard tried multiple times (with Probius and Junkrat) to create a Hero without Basic Attacks:

We've tried doing Heroes with no BA a couple of times now, and it always ends up feeling awkward. You can't kill Scouting Drones, Blackheart's treasure chests become exceptionally difficult to open.. But most importantly, it feels bad when you need to do that last little bit of damage (ex: Minion with a sliver of HP) to something and have to waste an ability CD/resource to do it. This holds true even for Heroes with relatively short CDs and few or no resource constraints.

For Junkrat, we stuck with the Melee BA for a while, but the rate at which we had to let him spam his Q in order for that to feel OK made him exhausting to play against - Grenade dodging fatigue was a real thing when he could shoot them almost constantly. His Q being so spammy also took away most of the decision making from using it. Increasing the CD on Q charges and filling the gap with a Ranged BA made him more engaging to play both as and against.^[1]

Hots Lucio Can He Do Percent Dmg Download

References[editedit source]

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